I’m happy to see that Miller is interested in continuing the good work already being done by the Sierra Club and myself in starting up the Metropass Affinity Program (themap.ca) - he’s obviously a fan of it, because what he is advocating is EXACTLY theMAP does!

Comment by Joe (BikingToronto)
October 25, 2006 @ 10:01 am

The two situations you compare, the Spadina Subway Extension and the Island Airport, are different in many ways.

Firstly, the federal government doesn’t fund the Port Authority at the expense of other similar projects in the City. Miller’s opposition is to the detrimental impact of the airport on the waterfront.

Whether the money for the subway would be better spent elsewhere (and I mostly agree that it would), the subway would still make a contribution to the region.

And as you said, that money isn’t going to flow from Ottawa and Queen’s Park for other things, at least not in the short term, so Miller might as well be in favour of it, since he can fund more of the BRT/LRT projects from the city’s coffers. To do otherwise would leave him open to charges of being parochial (something Pitfield accused him of yesterday).

Besides, looking beyond the borders of Toronto for a minute, traffic in York Region is positively horrendous. If introducing subway service there can provide an alternative, even if only for some people, reduce the number of cars crossing Steeles Ave. (the most highly travelled border crossing in the GTA), and promote increased density along Highway 7, then perhaps its worth a try. And it would have a positive impact on traffic in the north part of Toronto.

Even within our borders, the subway would significantly ease the traffic around York University, and and would provide reliable, accessible service for one of the city’s poorest neighbourhoods. I realize that gets us back to the point of all the neighbourhoods we could help with BRTs/LRTs, but again, there will be positive impacts and it’s the only thing Ottawa and Queen’s Park are willing to poney up for, so Miller’s doing the pragmatic thing in my view.

Comment by Asher
October 25, 2006 @ 11:15 am

David Miller is my choice for Mayor but I really wish the mayor didn’t have to be a politician. As Craig Cal points out, you can’t have it both ways…the foremost priority that the Spadina Subway extension has become contradicts the rest of the plan within which it sits. This subway extension, and the perpetuation of the myth that better transit has to mean more subway corrupts the vision of an integrated transit network that services the entire city. Miller needs to understand that he cannot compromise the vision and then expect Torontonians to get it.

Comment by Deidre Tyrell
October 25, 2006 @ 11:20 am

Subways are not cost effective anymore. Imagine the TTC line outdoors along the Allen. Now add two express lanes as well. Express and local, right up into the burbs; cant beat the price, service or construction timetable.

Millers subway love is misguided. At least he is not Candidate Jane who has a transit plan 9 from outer space.

Comment by scott d
October 25, 2006 @ 12:27 pm

We must admit that we would all love subways, but personally I would rather see subways downtown. I am in favor of intensification and higher densities, because I know it would create a more vibrant city. Obviously I am a little biased here, but if a new subway line is EVER built in Toronto, it should be the Queen subway.

>Subways are not cost effective anymore.

You mean here, right? New York is building a new subway line (the T) and extending the 7 after decades of little subway action and in some cases discontinuing express trains or skip-stop trains like the CC, the Q diamond and the 9.

One day we are going to need that capacity. Toronto’s population is due to surpass Chicago’s in 25 years, making it the third largest city in North America.

However, it makes you wonder why politicians would want to build subways, and it’s simple: One-time costs of subway stations lead to condo micro-cities around them which add to the city’s tax base… forever. Considering Toronto’s flawed funding structure, don’t we need all the money we can get?

Comment by kevin bracken
October 25, 2006 @ 1:38 pm

I was at that announcement and I chatted with the mayor for half an hour afterward, about which I’ll post on my own blog (www.eyeweekly.com/election2006) as soon as I have twn minutes to breathe.

The mayor has not said as much to me, but I suspect his support for extending Spadina boils down to this:

*The province and (once upon a time) the feds were willing to give money for it, but not for other priorities.
*It will act as a gateway for communters from north of the city, especially if it extends out into York Region, which then makes a big old case for the province/regional authority to kick more $$ into the TTC pot since it will no longer be a serive for Torontoinians only.

That said, I don’t think that it should be the priority that it is.

Comment by Edward Keenan
October 25, 2006 @ 3:23 pm

Further to Ed Keenan’s analysis, Miller knows in his bones that his relationship with Queen’s Park needs to be a strong and constructive as possible, and his support for the Spadina extension is all about making nice to an important cabinet minister — Greg Sorbara — and hoping there will be a pay-off down the road. He can stand up on a point of principle and say it’s a bad idea, but, at the end of the day, he likely knows this will do more harm than good for the city as a whole.

Comment by John Lorinc
October 25, 2006 @ 3:38 pm

I’d question the assumption that a subway extension to York University through to Steeles is a mistake because of low density. There are 50,000 full- and part-time students at York, plus another few thousand faculty and staff members. Even with some of these students coming from the north, tens of thousands of them would ride the subway up to the new York stop daily. Some students who choose to drive now, because getting to York by TTC would involve at least two transfers (from streetcar to subway to bus, for example, or from the Bloor-Danforth line to the Spadina line to the bus, for example), would be converted into transit riders if they only had to make one transfer instead.

In addition, Ward 8, which includes the York Campus, and runs from Steeles to Sheppard (where Downsview station is)/Grandravine, Jane to Dufferin, had over 50,000 residents in 2001, the majority of whom were not in single-family homes but in the large high rises that line Sentinel, Grandravine, Fountainhead, etc. (60.5% of residents, plus another 4.9% in low-rise apartment buildings). That’s way above the average for the rest of the city (37.6%).

Many of these residents who currently use buses from Downsview station to their homes would likely either walk (because they’d be within a 15 to 20-minute range) or take a shorter bus ride to and from a station on the extended Spadina line.

Assuming new riders from both the university and from the surrounding area adds to the “density” of the population served substantially — from 50,000 to 100,000.

It’s an expensive project, and it’s certainly very legitimate to debate how precious transit dollars should be spent, but it’s worth considering that there are some unique characteristics to the demographics of the area — it’s not the typical single-family-bungalow world that downtowners envision when they (we) hear the word “suburb”.

Comment by Molly
October 25, 2006 @ 5:26 pm

its all about  how people get to York.

York students come from all areas: east, west, north, south…. But that doesn’t mean that the subway will help them get there. The folks in Woodbrdige are not going to get our of their sooped-up Hondas and SUVs. Neither are the folkd fro Mississauga. Maybe mid and downtowers going to York will, but it won’t help the Scarberians, and North Yorkers either. The argument that it will help York is a sham. It will help developers along the route. Sobrara and the Royal Group have property all over the north end of the proposed line (nicely outlined by Spacing Votes writer John Lorinc in the previous Tornoto Life).
The Spadina-University line already gives us a perfect case study of what happens when you put a subway thru low density areas. Unless there is aplan to massively build up around the stations towards York DURING constrcution of the subway, then we should forget it and concentrate on dedicated lanes for buses and streetcars. The same amount of money spent on the York line will only increase ridership by 30,000 over a 20 year period. Instead, we could use that $2 or 3 billion that would have a HUGELY positive effect all over Toronto. We’re talking about having an affect on 500,000 people. Maybe more. Check out Steve Munro’s GTA tranit plan on his site: www.stevemunro.ca
For the same reason the Sheppard line got built and the Eglinton got canned is happening on the York line. It is all political. PCers in Willowdale and North York got the Sheppard line while Liberals and NDPers along Eglinton got shafted when Harris nixxed the second line.

So so so sad. Its why the TTC should not have politicians running it.

Comment by Mick Mick
October 25, 2006 @ 5:43 pm

It’s a mistake to think that there’s one pot of money that can be spent either on subways or surface transit. The reason Miller gives grudging support to the subway is that it involves EXTRA money from the province and perhaps someday the feds - money which would not otherwise be forthcoming to the city. Surface transit projects don’t have access to this money.

Also, I’d like to question the often-heard argument that we shouldn’t build subways if they don’t bring in more riders. If a subway will significantly improve the transit experience of existing riders (as the York subway definitely would), that should be included in the calculations.

The arguments for the subway are still iffy, but they’re not as clear-cut as presenting it as a tradeoff between surface transit and subways.

Comment by Dylan
October 25, 2006 @ 5:57 pm

The car is not going away. It is still the preferred choice among commuters and especially those who do not live in the downtown core serviced by the Yonge or Bloor/Danforth Subways. The only way you may get tehse people (myself included) out of their cars is if there was a subway alternative.

Creating dedicated bus lanes and right of ways at the expensse of removing lanes for traffic on major arterys (e.g. Kingston Rd.) only contributes to more traffic chaos as you now have less lanes for traffic

Comment by Bob the builder
October 26, 2006 @ 7:54 am

As pointed out above, instead of calling the subway above Steeles the Spadina extension it should be called the Sorbara extension. Miller has to support it as he is probably hoping for more provincial money to fill city funding gaps this year, not least the housing money the province won’t release.

Comment by Mark Dowling
October 26, 2006 @ 8:44 am

The only way a subway extension will really have an impact on traffic up that way will be if the 905 municipalities also significantly up their transit funding. One of the major complaints for York students who come in from Markham, Richmond Hill, Brampton, and elsewhere 905 [and sometimes even 519] is that if you miss your bus you have to wait another 20-30 minutes for the next one. Travel time is significant for students, as well as low income workers with families. Having a subway up at the Vaughan Mills mall would help only if it were a terminal for improved bus service.

Also, the York subway terminal will be just north of Steeles. It’s too far to walk for the majority of folk in Jane-Finch. Bus service - probably the Jane 35 buses, mostly - will have to head there. It’s actually gonna make it rough for students and faculty and campus workers who take the subway unless York shells out for a shuttle - most of the busy season at York is during the winter, and the bloody campuses’ landscape architecture produces really awful winds.

Maybe if there were LRT’s going east-west and intersecting with the new subway extension north of Steeles. Even one LRT at the terminus of the subway extension, going east west from brampton to richmond hill, would probably help.

All in all, I’d prefer better bus service throughout the City.

Comment by andrew
October 26, 2006 @ 11:37 am

Can you copy-edit this whole graf, please?

Overall, Miller’s plans for Toronto’s public transit system are more effective and achievable then his opponents, but he needs to rethink his position on the Spadina subway extension. The Mayor stated that Toronto doesn’t lack vision when it comes to transit, we lack the funds. Then why is he willing to sign off on an highly expensive megaproject knowing that it’s not cost-effective?

Comment by Joe Clark
October 26, 2006 @ 7:17 pm