It’s great to see and hear the automated stop announcements proliferating rapidly through Toronto’s streetcars. Last week, for the first, time, I took one of these streetcars to a part of town I wasn’t familiar with, and enjoyed the new experience of not having to look anxiously out the window to work out where I was and when I should get off.
It made me realize that, now that there is a consistent name for each stop on the surface network, people will be able to give directions to their residence by telling visitors the name of the streetcar or bus stop they should get off at. It was never a problem for major streets, of course, but it was always a minor complication when visiting people who lived on residential streets where one couldn’t be sure where the nearest stop was, and couldn’t be sure if or how the driver would describe it when you approached it. Maybe it will now become part of the culture when giving directions — “Get off at the xxxx stop and walk west a block …”
photo by Miles Storey
32 comments
I like them, it would be nice if the display was more visible from the back of a double street car, or they put a second one in. I noticed recently that they’re added announcements to the system for exiting by the rear doors and, on the POP routes, reminding you to have a proof of purchase on you at all times.
Some drivers seem to ignore the system and keep calling the stops in their own way, which is fine, they’re often more descriptive and sometimes entertaining.
We took the 54 Lawrence E bus from Eglinton Stn the other day to Don Mills — when it travels that long part of Leslie north of Inn on the Park, there are about 3 stops that are just addresses — 1330 Leslie (or something like that). I wonder if over time these random address will become landmarks for regular bus riders.
I absolutely detest the automated stop announcements. The “neutral” voice is intrusive and eradicates the unique experience of having the driver call out the stops… Think about it: no one will ever get to hear the singing street car driver again!
For passengers requiring assistance locating their stop, google maps should be more than adequate. If you need additional help, drivers have always been more than willing to alert passengers to the correct stop when travelling to a new destination.
Stop the noise pollution!
Despite the odd protest of noise pollution from Monica, I think the announcements are great. By protesting “Stop the noise pollution” Monica contradicts herself since she wants the drivers to personally say each stop — that means no reduction in noise, just a reduction of the automated voice. I don’t see how a neutral voice can be called intrusive. Its neutral because its meant to be easily understood by a wide range of language issues and hearing abilities.
As Miles points out, the drivers can still add context to stops if they wish. And who can argue with the announcements when they help those who can’t see or only understand words but can’t read English?
Adding the announcements is a great way to make riding easier for eveyone, inculding those who are using the streetcar for the first time or feel nervous taking transit (all you suburbanites!).
Monica – I understand that the autovoice can be turned off, but that means the driver must provide an equivalent service. Have personality and add information by all means but it must be a superset of compliance with the Human Rights Commission’s judgement against the TTC.
I have experienced subway announcements (on YUS almost exclusively for some reason) that were downright slurred and were either some kind of joke or someone with speech characteristics entirely unsuitable to the task they were given.
I think the system is actually quite good, however could the TTC “program”in different languages to help new immigrants and those that might have trouble with the english language.At least to give some useful information, after that vancouver tazer incident I wonder if it would help.Just imagine how tourists to our city would feel more welcome as well especially when travelling in the core.
I don’t find the voice intrusive at all… I find it fairly easy to tune out, actually.
I can see getting nostalgic for the low-tech version, though. I still get nostalgic for the old “whistle trains” from before those damn “chimes” were installed.
I like the new announcements and, in atypical TTC fashion, it was implemented fairly rapidly and without bugs.
The monotone female announced aside, my only wish is that they would announce connecting routes, like “Next stop Gerrard St. East; transfer available to the 506 streetcar”, or something like that.
The non-stop-related announcements by the system are spoken by a male, which at least provides a little variety.
Sure, Monica, wrestling with the Ajax-dependent Google Maps via your one-generation-out-of-date Jaws screen reader is really gonna help you when you’re sitting there on the streetcar. Because these things were put in place for blind people, not you.
If Google Maps is such a solution, another thing you personally won’t need is stop announcements from drivers.
@leonard: Indeed, this was uncharacteristically rapidly and efficiently done. Amazing what happens when the Commission gets sued. Maybe a class-action over the shelters on St. Clair might grease that particular squeaky wheel.
I saw the strangest thing happen with one of these signs approaching Queens Quay and Dan Leckie Way. The street name appeared as usual, but then the sign went into full-blown “donut shop” mode: rotating between a sparkle text effect, spinning letters, and a pixel-by-pixel dissolve. I don’t know whether that always happens there (an extra-flashy way to remember Dan Leckie) or it was just a one-time glitch.
For people who don’t speak English, the automated stop announcements and signs are a great way to learn pronounciation. I discovered that in Stockholm — you quickly figure out which part means “next stop” and can concentrate on matching the stop name to what you see on the screen. (It was eye-opening, because Swedish pronounciation is very different from English.)
I think the automatic announcement systems are great and I agree with the comments above in terms of making it easier for those who are new to the city, and those who are traveling to terra nova areas within the city, to locate the appropriate stop. Re. Monica’s Google Maps comment, Google doesn’t even show the subway stops on its rendering of Toronto (for some reason New York’s map has these)! My only complaint with the signs is that the quality of the LED displays could have been much better. There are e.g. German ones available and that have been available for a decade or so (http://www.schauf-gmbh.de/Bilder/lkw_33.jpg) that have much better alphanumeric display characteristics – not just single dots. Oh well, better than nothing. And agreed – connecting transit information would also be nice to hear.
The displays and announcements are great for me as a beginning teacher who supplies and goes for interviews all over the Toronto Board. I never know where to get out and it is especially hard to look out when the bus/streetcar is packed! I recently took a bus along Wilson St West and it was great to follow the sign/announcement and the map I had!
The signs also change for last minute detours too!
I’ve been on buses with similar features in Nassau County on Long Island. The buses there show/tell where you can transfer to which route at the various stops. There is also a speaker outside the front door that tells boarding passengers what bus they’re boarding. They’d sound something like: “This is an eastbound 94 Wellesley bus to Castle Frank station”.
I’m not sure if we’d really need the on-board announcements in another language. The only thing requiring translations would be “The next stop is…” If you’re new to the city and were following directions you’d be paying more attention to the actual stop name and not the introduction.
Finally, with all the stops being uniform through geocoding how long before a map with surface stops appears? There’s already one showing stops in the downtown area (College/Carlton-Parliament-Lake Ontario-Bathurst) in one of the travel guides for the city. It even indicates the Sunday stops. (Do the signs display the stops on Sunday?)
I really, really, really don’t like these things. They make a little sad. I don’t know why the TTC wasted money on a gimmick, something that makes people feel like they’re getting service improvements.
When I haven’t known where I’m going, I’ve asked the driver to tell me when my stop approaches. I fear this absolves new drivers of having to learn their routes really well, and will reduce the amount of human interaction between drivers and passengers.
Smitty, it’s not exactly a gimmick. Installing this system is simply complying with a ruling by the Ontario Human Rights Tribunal.
…I think the system is pretty good. It ensures that my driver won’t feel like they have to choose between calling out the stops on a rainy day and keeping their eyes on a slippery road. And it also means that my driver can’t forget to call out a stop I’ve asked them to announce (which has happened a handful of times to me).
I was going to say the same thing to to Smitty, and find it discouraging when people say they are not getting a service improvement when you have a handful of anecdotal evidence giving concrete examples improvement.
besides, the colourful characters can still add their own take by calling out surrounding points of interest. Those guys had the urge to do it before and I doubt that urge will just subside.
Though I think more efficiency will reign overall in the new system, are a couple things bad about this: on streetcars more than anywhere else on the TTC do you get the real weirdo announcers; there used to be a guy who drove the 506 College Car that called himself Captain Somethingorother (this was early 2000s maybe) and he would announce all kinds of things silly-like, including the ess near Brock St., with “And here’s a zig! And a zag!” Hate him or love him, he had personality.
And last month I had a totally crazy young overzealous streetcar operator on, again, the 506, who would not only announce each stop with eagerness and enthusiasm but would announce EVERY POSSIBLE CONNECTION at the stop, EVERY LANDMARK (like, “Women’s College Hospital, the Government of Ontario Publications Building, Kensington Market, Ministry of Whatnot”) and also THE TIME OF DAY and WHERE THEY WERE IN THE SCHEDULE. This guy was fucking insane and a little irritating but I hate to see room for charming weirdness edged out of the system by a robot.
The other thing is that once I was on the Pape bus and the announcements were automated by that voice and when I got off and saw the driver was a dude and not a lady I was totally confused.
liz, I must have had that same driver just last week on College. His gusto left me breathless, even from the back of the car.
I’m quite appreciative for this new installation, although the volume has seemed too loud on nearly-empty buses at night. Still, it’s better than a driver who incomprehensibly mumbles, or doesn’t speak into the microphone.
I have rarely heard a driver supplement the robo-announcements with a follow-up (one place I’d like to hear it is the old “Carlaw… Pape bus” on the 501).
But I have been on a Spadina car where the operator decided he was going to call out all the stops anyway, machine be damned.
Actually, that kind of works – the operator announcing the stops as well as the automatic system – because the automatic system only does it right after leaving the previous stop, so there’s still a space for the operator to announce as you arrive at the next stop (after all, the subway does both departure and arrival announcements). And that way you get the best of both worlds – the clearly enunciated automated announcement, and the more colourful and original operator announcement. I hope all the other operators who had a distinctive style decide to continue their own announcements to supplement the automatic one.
You know, you don’t have to be blind to appreciate this new installation. Just wait for the first really nasty snowstorm….when it’s all blurry outside and the the windows are all splattered with dirt, snow and ice.
Kudos to TTC (and the lawsuit)! Now, let’s attach some low tech route numbers and route maps/directions on TTC stops. It’s ridiculous that the stops do not have the route numbers!
I’d like to see the stops themselves named (signed) like they do in European cities. Eventually when the city gets a web-based route planner up and running, one will be able to type in something like –> depart: Carlton-Ontario / arrive: York University Common.
Gil, the extra stops are called our/displayed on Sundays.
liz, I know the 506 driver you’re talking about, but I’m surprised you think he’s “insane.” He’s my single favourite thing about the TTC. Seriously. It brightens my day whenver I get on his car. I keep meaning to write the TTC and ask them to give him a medal or something.
And I stand by calling these a gimmick. I just don’t see how an impersonal solution, the production of new pieces technology, the spending of capital dollars (however small), and the granting of some contract to some other tech firm somewhere down the line justifies the minimal assistance these things lend.
Some drivers already don’t care about their routes. When someone asked, a replacement bus driver on Queen snapped, “I don’t know where Carlaw is! I drive a bus in Scarborough!”
Brent, I’ve heard some drivers supplement. As someone pointed out, the announcements seem to be spaced out almost precisely for this purpose.
Smitty, if you find these so gimmicky, perhaps you can go to the TTC and fight another 10 years to have them removed.
liz, I know the 506 driver you’re talking about, but I’m surprised you think he’s “insane.†He’s my single favourite thing about the TTC.
I agree. I haven’t heard him announce the time, but the landmarks and transfer information is extremely useful. For example, he’ll say “Riverdale farms, 3 blocks north”…I’m quite surprised that he would be disliked.
Smitty, please think outside your frame of mind. For those who are blind, or deaf, getting around via transit is enough of a challenge without having to ask for special assistance. For those of us who really get into our reading, the stop announcements are helpful reminders. And, as noted above, these really and truly help those who are unfamiliar with the territory — whether visitors, newcomers, or just people exploring their own city.
My train driver this morning in Chicago did a great job of supplementing the “impersonal” announcements (here, they’re even done by some guy who lives 200 miles away) with courtesy announcements at each stop.
Automated announcements are great. Sure, drivers can sometimes be entertaining, but there are plenty of problems of leaving announcing to drivers. Based on my experience with the TTC:
1) Most of them seem to be quite silent during the entire ride.
2) Those who did say something only called out major stops, ignoring the multitude of smaller ones. Since many TTC routes have stops spaced very closely together, I often had trouble figuring out when I should pull the cord so the bus stops where I actually want it to stop, not one stop ahead or behind. With automated announcements the problem is gone.
3) Most drivers didn’t seem to put much effort into their announcements, mumbling them under their breath so that they were almost unintelligible. Sometimes they also completely mispronounced the names of the stops, or called out wrong stops… It makes for some entertaining stories (like one woman taking offence after the driver mumbled “Finch” so that it sounded like “bitch” :-)), but does not help TTC passengers, especially ones new to the city and/or non-English speaking.
Let the drivers drive and the sign do the work of calling out the next stop! Harry http://skinz.org
I haven’t got a problem with the concept of automated voice announcements on the TTC. My problem, (as with most of what the TTC undertakes these days) is with the execution.
That woman’s voice is not only monotone and depressing, but worst of all, amateurish. To millions of Torontonians – and to visotors alike – this is the de-facto voice of the city. Couldn’t we have put a bit more work into the screening and selection? I mean… it’s as though Giambrone said “hey, let’s use Cheryl over in accounting, I like the way she answers the phone”. That a more professional search didn’t take place in a city with thousands of under-employed actors – who have had REAL voice training – and who can pronouce Bloor as one word (vs. Blew’er) is a shame (and I wonder what ACTRA would think of this?).
No other World Class CityTM would have done anything like this. Travel through Europe and yes, even the states, and you get the sense they put time and effort into the “positioning” of the voice. Barcelona (male and female voices), Berlin, Stockholm, London… all have produced iconic experiences that don’t irritate. They’re background and easy to block out.
I, for one, now ride the TTC with my walkman on LOUD so that I don’t have to listen to Brampton Voice’s banal mispronunciations (no offence, Brampton).